I don't care one way or the other about the type or quality of the stamp and the end of the journey. To me it is the journey that matters.

I used store bought stamps in my letterboxes at first and plenty of people have come out and stamped in. They are pathetic compared to the stamps I have seen since, but that does not seem to influence most people I have talked to.

Again, it is the journey and the adventure, not the "prize" at the end.

Kyle
Team Armadillo

Eibhlin/Aisling wrote:
Hi,

I generally carve my own letterbox stamps. But, I'm wondering how
much the stamp matters to most current letterboxers.

I mean, I may to go out of my way to find a stamp that's hand carved,
IF I already know that it's gorgeous.

And, on the trail, if I can't seem to find the letterbox, I'll try
extra hard if I know that I'm looking for a box with a hand carved
stamp.

But, when it comes to selecting boxes to find in the first place, it's
at least 95% location-location-location. I love the chance to explore
places that are new to me. I love the thrill of finding a challenging
letterbox. (Or, on a very hot day here in Texas, finding ANY
letterbox!)

Anyone else?

Cheerfully,
Aisling
http://www.aisling.net/


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi,

Very nicely said, Kyle! Thanks!

Cheerfully,
Ais
http://www.aisling.net/

On 7/1/05, Kyle Klein wrote:
> Again, it is the journey and the adventure, not the "prize" at the end.

Dearest Aisling,

What a lovely sentiment you express, yes indeed it is all about the
hike. Of course that's why we letterbox.

Now put down the Hallmark card and get real. If one finds a letterbox
for which the placer put forth the Herculean effort of fishing through
the pocket lint and pulling out a buck-ninety-eight to hand to the
bored, gum-snapping, blond bimbo at the ACMoore check out then they
deserve just as much effort from the finders...a big yawn. If her
Ladyship goes to all the effort to pack her Lalique stemware and Royal
Daulton into a picnic hamper and have Bartleby lug it half way up
Mount Everest not to mention risking soiling her white sling-back peau
de soie pumps there had better be a hand carved stamp in that box. How
many times have you heard someone lauded on this list for their
beautiful store bought stamps? Even if you can't carve like
Michelangelo a chewed eraser is better that something you grabbed off
a shelf stuffed into Tupperware and flung into the weeds from your car
window. If you want to evaluate your own efforts refer to my dear
sister Ivy's letterbox rating system, I believe it's on mark Pepe's
web site still.

Regards,
Lady Prisspott

My dearest Lady Prisspott,

It's one thing to disdain Hallmark cards; it's a social calamity if
you don't know the hallmarks on your belongings.

If your picnic crockery is indeed labeled 'Royal Daulton', I suggest
that you waste no time asking your housekeeper about her shopping
habits. Your dishes sounds as if they are faux Royal Doulton.

May I suggest that the world is a far more gracious place when we
enjoy both our Hallmarks and our hallmarks.

I shall continue to enjoy letterboxing for the hike, with or without
the accoutrements of fine picnicking. And, no doubt, you will enjoy
letterboxing for your own reasons.

Yours
most sincerely,
Countess Aisling Mason Newton MacIntosh D'Art, nee Morey
http://www.aisling.net/


On 7/1/05, Lady Hydrangea Prisspott nee Hedge wrote:
> Dearest Aisling,
>
> What a lovely sentiment you express, yes indeed it is all about the
> hike. Of course that's why we letterbox.
>
> Now put down the Hallmark card and get real.
...
>If her
> Ladyship goes to all the effort to pack her Lalique stemware and Royal
> Daulton into a picnic hamper and have Bartleby lug it half way up

Wow, much like the FAQ that I read when I first started letterboxing this response smacks of elitism and snobbery.

I used small store bought stamps for my first hides. The stamps were then "adjusted to fit in the container and a special logbook created to also fit as these were "micro" letterboxes. I then spent a few hours picking just the right locations and coming up with what, in my new and inexperienced state, were good clues to make the search interesting. This is a far cry from throwing a stamp in a Tupperware container and throwing it out the window.

No, we don't laud people for their store bought stamps. And this is how it should be. The person did not create a work of art. However the person did take the time to put together the box and place it for the enjoyment of others. I know I have heard, maybe not on this list, people lauded for their well constructed boxes, well written clues, and clever hides.

Are there some boxes not worth finding, of course there are. But, I do not subscribe, for one minute, to the theory that the stamp alone determines the boxes worth.

I really hope that I am missing something here. I hope that your response was meant to be tongue in cheek and I just didn't get it. Ivy's rating system is, in my mind, clearly a humorous work.

If you are serious, I think Her Ladyship needs to realize that this activity is no longer, if it ever were, a sport of kings and lords, but an activity in which all the serfs happily partake. We all have different priorities and judgments concerning what should or shouldn't be part of a box, and all our feelings and efforts should be appreciated and respected.

Again, if you were not serious and I just didn't catch the wit or the sarcasm, my most humble apologies.

Kyle
Team Armadillo



Lady Hydrangea Prisspott nee Hedge wrote:
Dearest Aisling,

What a lovely sentiment you express, yes indeed it is all about the
hike. Of course that's why we letterbox.

Now put down the Hallmark card and get real. If one finds a letterbox
for which the placer put forth the Herculean effort of fishing through
the pocket lint and pulling out a buck-ninety-eight to hand to the
bored, gum-snapping, blond bimbo at the ACMoore check out then they
deserve just as much effort from the finders...a big yawn. If her
Ladyship goes to all the effort to pack her Lalique stemware and Royal
Daulton into a picnic hamper and have Bartleby lug it half way up
Mount Everest not to mention risking soiling her white sling-back peau
de soie pumps there had better be a hand carved stamp in that box. How
many times have you heard someone lauded on this list for their
beautiful store bought stamps? Even if you can't carve like
Michelangelo a chewed eraser is better that something you grabbed off
a shelf stuffed into Tupperware and flung into the weeds from your car
window. If you want to evaluate your own efforts refer to my dear
sister Ivy's letterbox rating system, I believe it's on mark Pepe's
web site still.

Regards,
Lady Prisspott





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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Again, if you were not serious and I just didn't catch the wit or
the sarcasm, my most humble apologies.

Dearest Kyle,

No you didn't, and apology accepted.

Her Ladyship has been on a "rest cure" and she feels a wee bitchy.
However since you opened the door and it's just you , H&H and
Armadillo left:

Without elitists what on earth will the serfs aspire too? Why elitism
has served the British Empire admirably for a thousand years. Do you
want a world of rampant mediocrity? Look what that did to the
television industry. How surprising to hear this from someone down in
Bush country, are you suggesting communist egalitarianism has done
anything for Russia or Cuba?

Waving the flag on this Independace Day weekend,
Lady Prisspott

PS That was a typo, the Prisspott diamond is rather large and heavy
and gets in the way. I did double check though and the local
constabulary assures me that Bartleby will be released in for
cocktail; he does such a lovely job with the gin and tonic.

There are certain carvers which I will go out of my way to find one of their boxes..... Jay Drew (Cor Dantis is awesome!), "the bee ;-)", TeamGreenDragon, The Dawnlanders, Camera Obscura, to name a quick few off of the top of my head.....

We have quite a few fantastic carvers up here in the Northeast, and I would never be able to say them all!!!!

Music Woman in CT


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

My Most Endearing Lady Prispott,

Perhaps you should either check your map or retake your geography class. I am from Illinois, which, last I checked, was solidly blue on the campaign map. Now truth be told, I am a Bush suporter, however, that puts me in the minority here in Illinois.

There is a difference, a large difference, between striving to do one's best and being an elitist. Everyone has their own strengths and weaknesses and a wise man plays to his strengths and avoids his weaknesses. If my strength lies in the writing of clues that are literary materpieces, and the hiding of boxes that blend in with their surroundings better than a chameleon, than that is upon what I should focus. If my weakness is the carving then that is what I should avoid.

I still maintain that a box's worth is not based solely upon the stamp inside of it but upon the totality of the experience which it inspires.

I believe that American equality won out over Brittish elitism over 200 years ago. Look where that great Empire is now. And let us not even begin to discuss the French! Elitism is what brought the British empire down. A failure to recognize that others ways may be just as good or better even when they are different has destroyed many an empire.

Again, one can strive for greatness without the arrogance that accompanies elitism.

Your Humble Servant,

Kyle
Team Armadillo


Lady Hydrangea Prisspott nee Hedge wrote:
Dearest Kyle,

No you didn't, and apology accepted.

Her Ladyship has been on a "rest cure" and she feels a wee bitchy.
However since you opened the door and it's just you , H&H and
Armadillo left:

Without elitists what on earth will the serfs aspire too? Why elitism
has served the British Empire admirably for a thousand years. Do you
want a world of rampant mediocrity? Look what that did to the
television industry. How surprising to hear this from someone down in
Bush country, are you suggesting communist egalitarianism has done
anything for Russia or Cuba?

Waving the flag on this Independace Day weekend,
Lady Prisspott

PS That was a typo, the Prisspott diamond is rather large and heavy
and gets in the way. I did double check though and the local
constabulary assures me that Bartleby will be released in for
cocktail; he does such a lovely job with the gin and tonic.




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Even if you can't carve like
> Michelangelo a chewed eraser is better that
> something you grabbed off
> a shelf stuffed into Tupperware and flung into the
> weeds from your car
> window.

I know where you can find a piece of sponge that's
supposedly a hitchhiker....and finding that is still
probably a little more exciting than finding the same
ole uncreative store bought stamps....

It's about the journey, yes....but it's also about the
artistic expression...which everyone is capable of
whether they think so or not....

--Armadillo Jo

We were going to plant a box today with a store bought stamp but yall
have scared us away.
We've only been in this group for about a week and there is some
serious ugliness going on. Think we'll cancel our membership to this
group.
FourFitzs

The bottom line is, letterboxing has several aspects to it. The artwork of
the stamp, the creativity of the logbook, the length and quality of the hike
and surrounding, even the value of looking through an almost-full logbook to
see the stamps of the others who've visited.

And each letterboxer will assign more or less value to each element. For
some, a hand-carved stamp is vitally important to their enjoyment, and they're
not interested in finding a box with a store-bought stamp. For others,
they're really only interested in a box with a good, long hike, and they don't want
to be bothered with a drive-by type of box.

And that's okay! As others have said, not all boxes are for all boxers.
We're all free to pick and choose which ones we want to look for! Of course,
it's better if we try not to get offended when someone expresses an opinion
that's different from ours, too, even if it's a strongly worded opinion.

DebBee


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I like the hand-carved stamps best, but, being addicted to boxing, I'll go
just about anywhere, anytime, hand-carved or not :-) and, one of the
best things is, as you pointed out, location! I have gone so many places I
might not have explored were it not for a box!

JOY

-------Original Message-------

From: Eibhlin/Aisling
Date: 07/01/05 15:11:08
To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [LbNA] Favoring hand carved stamps?

Hi,

I generally carve my own letterbox stamps. But, I'm wondering how
much the stamp matters to most current letterboxers.

I mean, I may to go out of my way to find a stamp that's hand carved,
IF I already know that it's gorgeous.

And, on the trail, if I can't seem to find the letterbox, I'll try
extra hard if I know that I'm looking for a box with a hand carved
stamp.

But, when it comes to selecting boxes to find in the first place, it's
at least 95% location-location-location. I love the chance to explore
places that are new to me. I love the thrill of finding a challenging
letterbox. (Or, on a very hot day here in Texas, finding ANY
letterbox!)

Anyone else?

Cheerfully,
Aisling
http://www.aisling.net/



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

nicely put, my dear countess

JOY

-------Original Message-------

From: Eibhlin/Aisling
Date: 07/01/05 16:32:15
To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [LbNA] Re: Favoring hand carved stamps?

My dearest Lady Prisspott,

It's one thing to disdain Hallmark cards; it's a social calamity if
you don't know the hallmarks on your belongings.

If your picnic crockery is indeed labeled 'Royal Daulton', I suggest
that you waste no time asking your housekeeper about her shopping
habits. Your dishes sounds as if they are faux Royal Doulton.

May I suggest that the world is a far more gracious place when we
enjoy both our Hallmarks and our hallmarks.

I shall continue to enjoy letterboxing for the hike, with or without
the accoutrements of fine picnicking. And, no doubt, you will enjoy
letterboxing for your own reasons.

Yours
most sincerely,
Countess Aisling Mason Newton MacIntosh D'Art, nee Morey
http://www.aisling.net/


On 7/1/05, Lady Hydrangea Prisspott nee Hedge
wrote:
> Dearest Aisling,
>
> What a lovely sentiment you express, yes indeed it is all about the
> hike. Of course that's why we letterbox.
>
> Now put down the Hallmark card and get real.
....
>If her
> Ladyship goes to all the effort to pack her Lalique stemware and Royal
> Daulton into a picnic hamper and have Bartleby lug it half way up



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

<< If her Ladyship goes to all the effort to pack her Lalique stemware and
Royal Daulton into a picnic hamper and have Bartleby lug it half way
up......
>>

How does one go about obtaining one of these Bartlebys????? I need one.

~~ Mosey ~~

I would prefer not to tell.
> How does one go about obtaining one of these Bartlebys????? I need one.
>
> ~~ Mosey ~~

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "fourfitzs"
wrote:
> We were going to plant a box today with a store bought stamp but
yall
> have scared us away.
> We've only been in this group for about a week and there is some
> serious ugliness going on. Think we'll cancel our membership to
this
> group.
> FourFitzs

I wish people like the four fitzs wouldn't give up because of a few
sour remarks. I like finding letterboxes, but there aren't enough of
them in some places. Given a choice, I'd rather that the Fitz's put
their well made and pretty stamp in a box and hide it for me to find,
than to be discouraged from letterboxing altogether. Somebody created
the store bought stamps too, didn't they? I bet they didn't just
throw
a tree and some rubber into a stampolator machine and were oh! so
surprised at the beautiful stamp that came out the tail end.

Yes, everybody loves a home made stamp, but if store bought stamps
mean more letterboxes to find, then by all means, use them!

And don't be discouraged by those who feel the need to impose their
religion into what is 98% friendly and hospitable pasttime. It's the
same mentality that makes a 65 year old man don spandex before riding
a bicycle.

And to the hand carvers: Please don't stop making your own. It
makes
your boxes special, but if everyone did it, it wouldn't be as much of
a treat.

I'm sure this has been said before, but it's sound, and it tends to
growth, and to a voluntary artistic expression, as opposed to a
forced, uninspired, chore.

Don't be dismayed. I use both store bought & carved stamps. I find carving
differcult, therefore most of my stamps are store bought. Start with a store
bought but do try to carve one sometime. It is a little hard at first but
easier than you think. Be simple.

STAR:W+S=DRR


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

well said! I think most of the boxers are nice and supportive, and I choose
to ignore those that are not. I love to box and for me it's all about the
journey! Boxing has taken me places I never would have gone otherwise. So,
hand-carved or store-bought, keep those boxes coming!

JOY

-------Original Message-------

From: Gregory
Date: 07/03/05 11:56:19
To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [LbNA] Re: Favoring hand carved stamps?


--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "fourfitzs"
wrote:
> We were going to plant a box today with a store bought stamp but
yall
> have scared us away.
> We've only been in this group for about a week and there is some
> serious ugliness going on. Think we'll cancel our membership to
this
> group.
> FourFitzs

I wish people like the four fitzs wouldn't give up because of a few
sour remarks. I like finding letterboxes, but there aren't enough of
them in some places. Given a choice, I'd rather that the Fitz's put
their well made and pretty stamp in a box and hide it for me to find,
than to be discouraged from letterboxing altogether. Somebody created
the store bought stamps too, didn't they? I bet they didn't just
throw
a tree and some rubber into a stampolator machine and were oh! so
surprised at the beautiful stamp that came out the tail end.

Yes, everybody loves a home made stamp, but if store bought stamps
mean more letterboxes to find, then by all means, use them!

And don't be discouraged by those who feel the need to impose their
religion into what is 98% friendly and hospitable pasttime. It's the
same mentality that makes a 65 year old man don spandex before riding
a bicycle.

And to the hand carvers: Please don't stop making your own. It
makes
your boxes special, but if everyone did it, it wouldn't be as much of
a treat.

I'm sure this has been said before, but it's sound, and it tends to
growth, and to a voluntary artistic expression, as opposed to a
forced, uninspired, chore.







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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ah, a debate that has raged since people first started hiding
plastic boxes in the woods. . .

Just make it clear in the posted letterbox description when a stamp
is store-bought (the default I think is hand-carved) and then
potential finders can decide for themselves.

My first effort at a hand-carved stamp I now think of as very
crude. However, I was soooo proud of it at the time and have left
it in our first letterbox as a testament to that learning curve we
all have to get through. Even if you're skeptical of your carving
abilities, give it a try. Improvement comes quickly.

DB

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "JOY" wrote:
> well said! I think most of the boxers are nice and supportive,
and I choose
> to ignore those that are not. I love to box and for me it's all
about the
> journey! Boxing has taken me places I never would have gone
otherwise. So,
> hand-carved or store-bought, keep those boxes coming!
>
> JOY
>
>

Dearest Letterboxers,

Her Ladyship can hold herself back no longer. To use the vernacular,
get over it!

I'm talking to the sensitive people who are afraid of a few posts on
this list serve. I've only carved one stamp for a letterbox and looked
like someone gave a grapefruit spoon and a piece of rubber to a
monkey. People who act perfect rarely are. There's no need what so
ever to be intimidated by them. Have a little spine and some self
confidence for goodness sake. As everyone said there are all kinds of
letterboxers and there will be someone that appreciates your
efforts...there will probably even be the occasional person who makes
nasty comments in your log book about the quality of your effort. I
personally discount both effusive praise and blatant
mean-spiritedness. Both are extreme reactions and therefore not likely
to be majority opinions.

Do what makes you happy and someone will appreciate it. If you're
doing it for some twit on a list serve then you're probably going to
be disappointed.

I know this next comment will be greeted by a chorus of people saying
it could have been said in a nicer way but it has and it hasn't
worked. People who say a comment on this list has ruined letterboxing
for them are rather childish. We've all seen a child quit in the
middle of a board game or some other competitive activity because they
are loosing; heck I've seen adults do it but it's still rather
annoying and childish behavior. This is what I hear every time someone
says that someone was mean and they're leaving. Why is it so hard to
brush it off and move on. If it's really about the hike, the artistic
expression, the beautiful location or the clever clues then why on
earth would some snotty comment from some pretentiou, pompous jerk
change any of those reasons? Try to remember that this list might be
about letterboxing but letterboxing isn't about this list.

Make boxes that make you happy and for crying out loud don't make them
for me or any other loud-mouthed opinionated lunatic on a list serve.

Lady Prisspott

PS. DB you had better indeed watch your step. Given the right spin a
tea saucer can take the head off a recalcitrant maid servant at 50 yards.

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Lady Hydrangea Prisspott nee
Hedge" wrote:
>
> Try to remember that this list might be about letterboxing but
> letterboxing isn't about this list.
>

Well said. I think that a lot of people would do well to remember
this -- it is not about this list and it is not about the people or
the things they do. It is not about that one snotty person who didn't
like your clues or your stamp, it is not about the jerk who made you
feel like an imbecile because you couldn't follow his clues and find
the box, it is not about that don't-know-any-better new boxer who
placed a box less than 3 feet from your super cool mystery box and
gave away your clues in the process...

Letterboxing is about what you want it to be about. If you are in it
for the hand-carved stamps, then look for boxes that specify such or
learn to know who the awesome carvers are; if you are in it for the
hiking, then choose boxes with a decent hike and spend a day walking
up the side of a mountain or through a lush forest; if you are in it
for the history, there are boxes for you too... Not choosing to look
for somebody's box because it does not satisfy your interests is not
being a snob -- it is simply getting out of a hobby what you
personally want from it. On the other hand, just because a box
doesn't meet your interest is not reason to criticize it either. Take
the ones you want and leave the others for somebody else. Just
because they don't knock your socks off, doesn't mean they aren't
exactly what floats the boat for the next guy.

>
> Make boxes that make you happy and for crying out loud don't make
> them for me or any other loud-mouthed opinionated lunatic on a
> list serve.
>
>

Amen!


SpringChick

I am very impressed with some of the carvings I have seen, and it makes
me envious of the owner's skills. I love seeing the beautiful visitors
stamps in the logbooks. I now try to carve all my stamps, but only a
few are really any good. I also write "hand-carved stamp" in the clue
as an enticement.

> I generally carve my own letterbox stamps. But, I'm wondering how
> much the stamp matters to most current letterboxers.

Well.. I am a newbie at hard carving as anyone can tell from my
Mo'Town gathering box... .but I am addicted and now when I see a hand
carved one.. I appreciate it more...

Kody

Hey, I thought it was very good for a first attempt (and humorous!). I was
glad you decided to "take the plunge" and start carving. We have to admit
that we do vastly prefer finding a hand-carved stamp.

Wisconsin Hiker

-----Original Message-----
From: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of K & L
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 5:33 PM
To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [LbNA] Re: Favoring hand carved stamps?


Well.. I am a newbie at hard carving as anyone can tell from my
Mo'Town gathering box... .but I am addicted and now when I see a hand
carved one.. I appreciate it more...

Kody





Yahoo! Groups Links

P.S. I forgot to mention that we also appreciate the custom designed
stamps that people send out to have made by a company rather than
carving the stamps themselves. I've read that this is common in
Dartmoor, England. In our area, "Matt the Rat" has some clever ones.

Wisconsin Hiker

----- Original Message -----
We have
> to admit
> that we do vastly prefer finding a hand-carved stamp.
>